E: apparently it needs to be said that I am not suggesting you switch to Linux on your phone today; just that development needs to accelerate. Please don’t be one of the 34 people that replied to tell me Linux is not ready.
Android has always been a fairly open platform, especially if you were deliberate about getting it that way, but we’ve seen in recent months an extremely rapid devolution of the Android ecosystem:
- The closing of development of an increasing number of components in AOSP.
- Samsung, Xiaomi and OnePlus have removed the option of bootloader unlocking on all of their devices. I suspect Google is not far behind.
- Google implementing Play Integrity API and encouraging developers to implement it. Notably the EU’s own identity verification wallet requires this, in stark contrast to their own laws and policies, despite the protest of hundreds on Github.
- And finally, the mandatory implementation of developer verification across Android systems. Yes, if you’re running a 3rd-party OS like GOS you won’t be directly affected by this, but it will impact 99.9% of devices, and I foresee many open source developers just opting out of developing apps for Android entirely as a result. We’ve already seen SyncThing simply discontinue development for this reason, citing issues with Google Play Store. They’ve also repeatedly denied updates for NextCloud with no explanation, only restoring it after mass outcry. And we’ve already seen Google targeting any software intended to circumvent ads, labeling them in the system as “dangerous” and “untrusted”. This will most certainly carry into their new “verification” system.
Google once competed with Apple for customers. But in a world where Google walks away from the biggest antitrust trial since 1998 with yet another slap on the wrist, competition is dead, and Google is taking notes from Apple about what they can legally get away with.
Android as we know it is dead. And/or will be dead very soon. We need an open replacement.
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the vast majority of commenters here either have no direct experience with a Linux phone or have seen some shallow youtube “review” of a dude swiping the same two screens left/right and extrapolate a buncha shit that has no contact with reality.
presently, and in the foreseeable future, linux phones aren’t an android alternative, they are just linux on the phone, i.e. they allow you to do linux shit on a handheld device.
like, the bleeding edge version of any variant (plasma mobile, gnome, phosh) isn’t even close to an Android phone from like 2015, let alone a modern one.
and that’s before we touch on the pillars of mobile tech like fluidity, battery efficiency, reliability, etc., none of those things are even in a remotely passable state, not to mention - using the thing to make calls. you are better off forgetting about the camera, as well.
and the reason is simple, not only is there a gargantuan discrepancy between evil corp’s resources and the predominantly unpaid enthusiasts, each dev team’s reimplementing shit that’s already solved on another platform. apple doesn’t have to do that. google as well.
then there’s the idea that the javascript-backed Gnome - that has issues running fluidly on super-capable hardware - is the basis on a low-power device on which the linux mobile phone experience is built. reinventing solved shit, but in a stupid way - THREE FINGER swipe on a phone, really?
although there’s a solid app base, the apps that are supposedly mobile friendly are few and far between, most are just downright unusable on a vertical screen and dog help you if launch an electron app. firefox, even with pmOS patches (useless without) is tiresome to use. you can forget about dating, ubering, banking, or even just using a messenger everybody else does.
if you’re squeamish about flashing custom recoveries and ROMs, the e.g. pmOS install process is way, way, way more involved and failure prone. if you go with ubuntu touch or mobian, even more so.
finally, if you’re talking about a device that you’ve grown accustomed to to the extent that you’re using it subconsciously, swiping and multitasking and such whilst walking and dodging other pedestrians - no such thing exists over here.
I’m just tying this up because I keep reading about “switching”, people are either delusional or misinformed, there’s nothing (yet) to switch to.
get a couple of $50 ex-flaghips to play with, flash lineageOS on one and pmOS on the other and that should hold you over for a coupla years.
apparently it needs to be said that I am not suggesting you switch to Linux on your phone today; just that development needs to accelerate.
I’m not critiquing your post, I’m just clarifying to a buncha people who think otherwise that it’s not an option.
as to “it needs to accelerate”, I have a grim outlook. the only way it’s gonna do that is if there significant cash behind it and if everything non-essential is to be trimmed so that a functional platform can emerge. in our ever-enshittifying, greater-fool-theory investment climate, it’s doubtful there loose capital with such an agenda, and I doubt such a thing is even on the horizon.
same way with “desktop linux”; like, can you image where we’d be if every development effort is geared towards just one DE/WM, instead of tons of duplicated efforts and abandoned paths? yeah, good things eventually emerge from all the disjointed chaos, but eventually. and our joint assessment is that we’re running outta time for the “eventual” part.
It’s not great but lots of people are using it today. There are multiple entire businesses built on it. It may not fit your needs but it obviously does for many. And it’s only going to get better.
see, this is the thing I’m talking about. your comment indicates that it’s possibly a viable alternative to OS developed by the wealthiest corps in the world, for 15+ years and people are like “ok, there’s options”…
it is nowhere near that. it’s linux on a mobile device, and that’s such a humongously, vastly different thing than an alternative and that should be the first and foremost thing said. same with the “android is linux” bozos in every thread (it really, really isn’t) who are not helping the issue, at all.
and then we can dwell on whether it’s usable or not in its present state.
it’s possibly a viable alternative to OS developed by the wealthiest corps in the world, for 15+ years
It already is. It’s just a matter of porting it over to a different form factor.
Eh, for desktop I’d say we’re just about there now. For people who don’t use their computers for much more than gaming and web browsing Bazzite works pretty great. Helped a friend who doesn’t do much more than that build a PC and install an OS and they seem to be doing fine with it, no complaints so far.
There is always the option of waydroid to get android apps running on Linux. It’s not a great solution, but a first stopgap measure to use services only available as apps.
that’s not a thing, presently. the OS has trouble running on its own and handling “native” apps, let alone introducing an emulation to the mix.
of course, it can and does work to some extent - but not one where you depend on it, like you do with modern phones.
Not to mention navigation and using the car screen.
Smart phones are simultaneously such a wonder of human engineering and have become such a disappointment of human greed.
This whole situation has made me just care less about my phone, and use it less in my life while I use Linux PCs much more.
I don’t see my phone as a “computer” at this point, really. It’s more of a communication appliance. If I’m launching an app that’s not texting, calling, GPS, or music, it’s probably a replacement for a website I’d normally use on a PC.
Linux phones could change this though. The idea of your PC being your docked phone would work great for most use cases. Unfortunately though, even though I would love it I don’t really see the general public jumping at the chance to get back to the desktop experience. I could maybe see a little traction in the business world.
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Anywhere there is freedom and thoughtful development there are corporations waiting to capitalize on it and ruin it.
Check out postmarketOS, a real Linux distro for phones with a 10-year life cycle goal and mainline kernel support. It’s not daily-driver ready for everyone, but it frees you from Google and OEM lockdowns. If we want an open mobile future, this is the project worth supporting.
This looks great. If we collectively threw some funding behind a few worthy projects, even at 1-10€ per person, it could really accelerate development.
Donation page link for those who’d also like to send some cash their way: https://opencollective.com/postmarketos
Thanks for the suggestion! I was about to ask what non-Android Linux options are available.
My next phone will be a ThinkPad because it has a SIM card slot.
With the simcard slot can you use mobile data? If so thats amazing and I will be looking for that feature on my next device.
Probably, I will try that later.
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I bought mine (P14s AMD) this year and it works flawlessly.
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Lets just load a e sim on the steamdeck and call it a day
I’ll consider a Linux phone as long as the following are met:
- Battery life is decent (for me this means a minimum of 24 hours of light use and no mystery drains).
- Reliable enough to not fear for my life when traveling.
- UX is polished enough to not be painful.
- Email notifications and communication apps work correctly (Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp).
If these are met, I’ll buy whatever is available in a year or two.
communication apps work correctly (Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp).
Google and Facebook will cooperate. WhatsApp will never work reliably.
At this point, the “best” solution might be buying one of those SBC (single board computers) that also has an android image, like orangePi or ODroid and “build” the rest of the phone on top of it. Might be the only way people can get a screen smaller than 6" as well. I say Android in this case because it has access to all the apps without needing emulation or Waydroid
OOOOORRRRR, just buy an used older phone that you know is easy to unlock and install a custom rom. Did that with a motorola G6, am happy with lineage. Not the fastest phone by a long shot, especially as newer versions of many apps just introduce more bloat because fuck you, but perfectly usable for messaging and video watching. Also has a headphone jack!
I mean Android itself is the main problem here…
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I went with a Sonim XP3Plus flip phone
This is how I solved the modern tech problem.
You didn’t solve any problems, you just opted out of a whole bunch of features.
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I did solve the problem; by choosing not to bother with it
Walking away does not solve the problem. It just makes it no longer your problem. Everyone else still has to deal with it. Not everyone has that privilege.
If we all stopped the world would adapt. The council let the street signs rot because everyone is on gmaps, restaurants stopped having menus just qr codes, places in England were you get kicked out if you insist to pay by cash.
All of it would be reversed if… we reversed A pipe dream but weirder things happened
If we all stopped
Okay well let me know when you get everyone to stop. Until then…
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They did reverse the cash ting at the pub, every day a different customer would have a proper argument about it. Don’t ask why I was there everyday tho
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Yes and no. Some of us actually need our phones to accomplish things. Work, primarily. As people mentioned elsewhere, simple things like accessing their banking accounts. I wish we didn’t, but we do.
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I’d never do banking on a smartphone; not in a million years.
They’re not doing it by choice. The phone is used as mandatory authentication to access the account.
One theft or hack in public, and all your money and data are at risk
…and how do you suppose your laptop is immune from this? Or your desktop, even?
that’s the aspect you want to keep avoiding.
I’m not avoiding anything. What you fail to understand is that not everyone’s situation is the same as yours. For some of us, these things are outside of our control.
😬 I’m writing this on my pixel 3… What happened??
My wife’s pixel 3 just busted without any warning a few years ago. PLEASE be sure to have backups of your things and passwords. At the time they didn’t remember their password and was only logged in on their phone. We were able to recover through my email but it wasn’t a recovery address so it was really scary.
The worst part is we already had a family password manager they weren’t using, so it was very difficult to not make it seem like an “I told you so” moment, but they’re on it now and have backups and stuff.
But yeah. We took it to some phone repair guy and he tried a bunch of different stuff. The motherboard just failed or something. No way to extract anything. He said it happened a lot with that model (well, he’s only seeing the bad ones but still).
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I’m about a tech zero skill but I am at Lemmy for THIS news. Thank you for resisting complete shitification hegemony. Resist!
What I really hope for is a way to install linux on any mobile device, be it Samsung, Google, One Plus or whatever, like we do with Linux… with linux it doesn’t matter which brand is your laptop… it always works, and if we can replicate that it means true freedom and also it means linux mobile phones are gonna be more fun and broader than desktop computers… cuz everyone uses smart phones.
The discussions here are quite passionate so a bit of a reality check :
“PineStore has also discontinued the PinePhone Pro which was talked about in the last recent blog post. TLDR, sales were low”. https://pine64.org/2025/08/16/august_2025/#pinephone-pro-discontinuation
So… people here say they do want one, but clearly not like that one.
Also recently the crowd funding of https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/liberux-nexx--3 barely reached 10% of €1,434,375 Fixed Goal with just 135 backers.
So… also clearly not that one either.
So what accelerated development do people not just want to claim they do want, but actually pay for?
what accelerated development do people not just want to claim they do want, but actually pay for?
The suggestion was that we need it, not that a large number of people want it.
The software development really needs to happen before hardware sales. Pretty pointless without it.
I’ll switch away from Android when there’s a good alternative, but I’m not very technical and need something with a nice GUI and an easy installation process. Hopefully Linux will offer something like that someday, but I don’t think it’s there yet.
Send me back to the 90s with the flip phone. Old Nokia with a changeable battery, no malicious firmware that has spyware built in. It’s just a phone.
no malicious firmware that has spyware built in.
Sure about that?
spyware in a 90s phone ? Where it was even a miracle to be able to connect to Internet ? Yeah, they were able to pinpoint your position using the cell towers (which were less than today so not that precise) and the telecom know who and when you were calling but other than that…
Trust devices that are open and run open firmwares not old devices
True but I was only pointing out that what is a problem in modern smartphone was not a problem in older dumb phone since they lack the functionalities (and the supporting infrastructure)
You are assuming it wasn’t a problem back then
It is a little difficult to spy on phone owner (except knowing where the phone is located) when everything you have is SMS and a memory measured in Kb, leaving aside that every phone had its own firmware incompatible with everyone else.
Of course telecom companies always know where you were and who you call, like today, but at most they can tap and read the SMS.For context, GPRS was rolled out around 2001, before that you basically have not any data connection if not plugging to the phone an external modem.
That’s just all electronics outside of Linux at this point.
I imagine building on existing AOSP project like GrapheneOS or LineageOS would be the easiest path forward. There is already a decent ecosystem of open source apps available. You’d still need to figure out what to do with proprietary apps like Slack that regular people might need for day to day use.
Ultimately, the problem lies in lack of a hardware vendor willing to take make open phones that are geared towards running a custom OS on without having to jailbreak them. I really think the only way this can happen is if there was a vendor that focuses on providing a full stack open source system for mobile. Maybe a company like Liberux or even Framework will succeed at doing something like that at some point.
Liberux is using waydroid to add compatibility from what I’ve seen, so that may be the way forward where you have a base Linux system, and then a layer for running Android apps on top of it.
I agree. As it stands, there is no immediate problem with buying a vendor unlockable phone for LineageOS or GrapheneOS. It does seem like Google is slowly closing the doors to FOSS, so the future could require an AOSP fork. But it also might not. We don’t really know for sure. As long as LineageOS and GrapheneOS exist and have developers, we have nothing to sorry about.
If, in the future, all hardware manufacturers fail us, I have used Waydroid on an old Thinkpad, and it is fantastic. And, more in the Linux ecosystem is Android Translation Layer which translates Android syscalls into Linux syscalls. It is buggy, but I could see it getting better in the future.
Anyway, I’m not really worried. There are still a lot of paths forward, and FOSS advocates are persistent.
Yeah, the foundation exists and it’s just going to be a question of building out on top of it. It’s also worth noting that the app ecosystem outside google is starting to become fairly complete as well. I find that in practice I only use a handful of apps such as email client, messenger, music player, weather app, a browser, a maps app, and a calendar. That accounts for most of what I do on my phone day to day, and there are mature open source options for all of these apps.
I got a Sailfish OS last year seeing the writing on the wall already with all the bootloader locking. It’s been bumpy to put it lightly, but at least it has Android apps to help get over the gaping holes of basic missing apps like a halfway decent XMPP client. …But at least native WhisperFish lets you get around the lack of Signal on most non-duopoly platforms.
