• dual_sport_dork 🐧🗡️@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    61
    arrow-down
    2
    ·
    edit-2
    2 years ago

    TL;DR: Due to being smaller and lighter, electric bikes and mopeds require significantly less energy to move themselves around than an electric car. The article starts with a headline about “oil demand” but then spends much of the rest of its length harping on consumer monetary costs instead. I could have said that in a lot fewer words. Actually, I just did.

    Also, in SE Asia and other places where the primary mode of transport is a small motorbike, as it happens these small motorbikes actually pollute a lot for their displacement due to having basic uncomplicated engines, often not running very well, and lousy or absent emissions controls. ICE vehicles are also at their worst fuel consumption/distance traveled ratio when they’re idling or crawling around urban areas at low speed. Replacing these with electric versions just makes sense.

    Full disclosure: I own a gas guzzling truck, a fuel efficient car, seven motorcycles, and an electric bicycle. I use different tools for different jobs, as appropriate. If you’re looking for a magic bullet, you will probably need it in a few different calibers.

  • grue@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    46
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    2 years ago

    This article is vastly understating the potential benefits of e-bikes. Like-for-like replacements for car trips are only the tip of the iceberg; the real benefit of e-bikes is that the more people that use them, the less car parking we need. That means we can put back all those buildings we destroyed when we razed our cities for the car.

  • NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    28
    ·
    2 years ago

    My only problem with ebikes is there’s no chance in hell I’m consistently driving on the road with cars.

    With how convenient these are, I hope there’s more push to add protected bike lanes in road heavy places to increase adoption.

  • scarabic@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    26
    ·
    edit-2
    2 years ago

    Goddamn I love my ebike. It’s still very much a bike, but it changes the equation. I can ride a nice big heavy comfortable cruising frame, pull my kid in a trailer bike, get up steep hills that would otherwise stop me, and go 4x as far before I’m tired. It is just a total game changer. I’ve rediscovered the joy of riding my bike like I haven’t known it since college. I’m older and creakier than ever but my bike enjoyment hasn’t diminished - it has increased.

    • Lenny@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      6
      ·
      2 years ago

      Same! I live on the top of a big hill, so leaving my house on a bike was never the issue, but I always dreaded the ride home. Now I own an ebike and I regularly use it to go into town for groceries. In fact, I just added a second basket so I can buy three full bags of groceries in one trip. I find myself actually looking forward to errands now.

  • TurboDiesel@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    25
    ·
    2 years ago

    Whaaaaat? You mean electric last-mile micromobility cuts down on emissions in a significant way, just like people had been saying for years? Who would have thought?

    • isles@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      16
      arrow-down
      3
      ·
      2 years ago

      Car-brain finds small electric vehicles are more efficient, in shocking study.

  • CADmonkey@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    24
    ·
    2 years ago

    When I was younger and more invincible around 2005, I bought one of these crappy Ebay engine kits for a bicycle. One thing I noticed is that it wasn’t really any slower from home to work than a car, because I could go around traffic. An E-bike would have been great. A lot of them get around on 500 watt or 750 watt motors, which is considerably smaller than an electric car’s motor.

    I’d have one now, but it’s hard to ride one when I have to carry a kid with me most places.

    • grue@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      29
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      2 years ago

      I’d have one now, but it’s hard to ride one when I have to carry a kid with me most places.

      I got an e-bike because I needed to carry a kid (actually, two) around with me. FYI, cargo bikes are a thing:

        • DrFuggles@feddit.de
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          3
          ·
          2 years ago

          It will never not be funny to me how scared some people are of any transportation that’s not a car.

        • daltotron@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          2 years ago

          Nah this is completely right though. Soon as she stops those two kids are gonna bonk heads together, the smaller one needs a bike seat at the very least, and the toddler probably needs one as well. You could still do that with a bike like this, so it doesn’t discount the point entirely, but the image itself is a pretty stupidly conceived piece of work.

    • paraphrand@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      6
      ·
      edit-2
      2 years ago

      It’s fun how the preview image for the article has two kids being carried around. But I can understand if you don’t see that as safe in your area, etc.

    • erwan@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      2 years ago

      I love my Bafang too but be careful of regulation depending on your country, an e-bike is 250W so of you put a more powerful motor you get in the moped category with different rules (helmet, back mirror, insurance…)

    • Michal@programming.dev
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      11
      ·
      2 years ago

      Second, they are more fun and you get to avoid all the traffic.

      Third, cheap to run, no need to pay insurance, taxes, parking.

      Fourth, anyone can ride it even children, no drivers license needed.

      And so on…

    • Smoogs@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      2
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      2 years ago

      For people with disabilities and chronic injuries, yes they are better and provides accessibility. Don’t forget that people with disabilities exist in this universe too.

    • AMDIsOurLord@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      4
      arrow-down
      7
      ·
      edit-2
      2 years ago

      Less effort? I don’t know where environmentalists got the idea that the average guy is a cross fit three time gold medalist, most people want effortless traversal

      • ToeNailClippings@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        12
        ·
        2 years ago

        This is the problem with bikes. When the car dominated it lead to bikes being a sport thing only. My Grandfather rode a bicycle everywhere. To the shops, to his mates, to the pub, definitely to work (he said the gates opened at 5pm and all the bikes rolled out into the road). He also smoked like a fucking chimney. Everyone did back then. So no, the problem is not environmentalists having unreasonable expectations on the human body, its modern people having become lazy and weak - even to the point where they wont investigate how people used to get by.

        • starclaude@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          2 years ago

          easier to steal too, which why prefer folded bike so I can take it to my office instead of parking it outside for easy theft

          • Electricorchestra@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            2 years ago

            I would love to have a Brompton or something like that for the same reason. Or easier to take it to other cities to ride.

        • Ann Archy@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          3
          arrow-down
          3
          ·
          edit-2
          2 years ago

          It also makes you less fat, and smarter. Yes, exercise actually makes you smarter. Maybe we should push people towards exercising, and let them discover bikes by themselves?

          • Electricorchestra@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            4
            arrow-down
            2
            ·
            2 years ago

            I’m a cyclist myself and a few members of my family went out and bought ebikes before they would even go on casual kid friendly rides with me on their traditional bikes. While I appreciate the ebike making people more confident biking I feel like the people I know with ebikes could have literally just used a traditional bike and in a month they wouldn’t find it hard.

            • Smoogs@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              1
              ·
              2 years ago

              People with disabilities would benefit. We get it. You don’t approve of them having something that could possibly benefit them.

              • Electricorchestra@lemmy.ml
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                2 years ago

                I didn’t mention people with disabilities. I’m very pro people with disabilities buying and using ebikes. What I am attempting to get across is that a lot of people would do great with trying to cycle before dropping big money on an ebike.

          • Smoogs@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            2 years ago

            Right so everyone with chronic injuries are just too stupid to work it out! Of course. So simple! /s

      • Smoogs@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        edit-2
        2 years ago

        Or that people with disabilities exist and probably benefit from e-bikes too.

  • ToeNailClippings@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    8
    ·
    2 years ago

    Cyclists have been telling the media and the public this for 50 years (we used to have electric milkfloats here in the UK in the 1960s to 1990s). And they were demonised and gaslit for it.

    • Ann Archy@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      2
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      2 years ago

      Proponents have been fought tooth and nail since electric vehicles were invented, and it was the public who was gaslighted- not they. Why try to change the minds of those who know they are right, when you can just change the minds of people not to listen to them…

      “You can fool some people all of the time, and all people some of the time, but you can not fool all people all of the time.”

    • looeee@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      2 years ago

      No matter how you feel about them, when your mate shows you his new electric car you still greet him with a request for a pint of semi skimmed.

  • nutsack@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    12
    arrow-down
    6
    ·
    edit-2
    2 years ago

    these are feasible in cities that you wouldn’t want to drive a car in anyways. probably not so good for commuting around Boise Idaho

  • FishFace@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    5
    arrow-down
    2
    ·
    2 years ago

    If you’re not that wealthy you might be able to afford a car but not want to buy a car and an expensive e-bike. A car is useful for short distance trips in bad weather, longer trips that might not be the majority of your travelling, and transporting stuff that won’t fit on a moped (or an e-bike unless you get a trailer… or bigger stuff than that.) In that case you’re going to buy the one tool that covers your needs.

    • Fried_out_Kombi@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      12
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      edit-2
      2 years ago

      On the other hand, a car has far greater maintenance costs. The car has license, insurance, maintenance, gas, parking, etc., whereas an ebike is basically free in comparison. Electricity to power an ebike is pennies, and maintainance is a few basic tools and a new tire or inner tube on occasion.

      With all the money saved, you can just rent a car for the handful of days the ebike genuinely is not sufficient.

      • FishFace@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        arrow-down
        6
        ·
        2 years ago

        Yeah, which is why it’s the reasonably wealthy people who have cars and not bikes. But that includes almost everyone in developed countries.

        E-bikes are kind of a red herring here anyway; there’s little practical use-case for them that isn’t already covered by unpowered bicycles unless you live somewhere very hilly. (Even in moderately hilly places you get used to hills quite quickly). It’s not unreasonable to do a shopping run on a bike as long as the shop isn’t far away… But if it is, an e-bike won’t help you get there in a reasonable length of time.

        • grue@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          7
          ·
          2 years ago

          E-bikes are kind of a red herring here anyway; there’s little practical use-case for them that isn’t already covered by unpowered bicycles unless you live somewhere very hilly. (Even in moderately hilly places you get used to hills quite quickly).

          I got a cargo e-bike specifically because I got tired of hauling two kids up hills in a trailer pulled by my regular bike.

  • Desistance@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    6
    arrow-down
    3
    ·
    2 years ago

    Not sure what electric cars has to do with this topic. But I guess someone wanted to start a fight between car people and non car people going by the extreme cross posting.