they are useless today where you need to be 18 to buy alcohol.
[citation needed]
It’s certainly possible to circumvent it, but where I live most people don’t become regular drinkers at 15. It makes it harder to access, and many people actually do want to follow the law. IMO a social media ban is going to work the same way - many will circumvent it, but many others won’t bother.
they are useless today where you need to be 18 to buy alcohol.
[citation needed]
Never seen the group of underage boys waiting outside the shop for the 18 old friend to buy beer (or any other liqueur) for everyone ?
It’s certainly possible to circumvent it, but where I live most people don’t become regular drinkers at 15. It makes it harder to access, and many people actually do want to follow the law. IMO a social media ban is going to work the same way - many will circumvent it, but many others won’t bother.
Neither where I live boys became drinkers at 15 (oh well, some do) but the point is that if a “filter” or ban where you need to be present and there is a person to check is easily circumvented, the classic example of the older friend who buy beers for everyone, I have no faith that a ban based on something virtual has any chance of success. True, it would be harder than the old “are you old enough to access the site” version, but you understimate 15 year old boys (and girls obviously). There are ways to make the ban work but I have the feeling that these solutions would be considered intrusive and against privacy.
For example, the social network can ask for the SSN (or equivalent) and check against the entity responsible to assign the number to check if is valid and of legal age and then keep the number to avoid to be used by someone else (like they keep the email).
But a solution like this is too easy to abuse: the social network has a SSN that they know it is true and valid and the state know a certain person has an account on a certain social network, now imagine the state that ask also the nickname you used on the social network to validate your SSN…
I never said that it’s impossible to circumvent. It’s just harder than if there were no restriction at all, and that does make a difference. And buying alcohol for your 1-year-younger friend is one thing, but buying alcohol for a 15yo is quite another. When I was that age, few people regularly hung out with people that much younger.
I agree that this type of social media ban shouldn’t be made at all, though. What I do want is filters that can be activated by parents that are relatively difficult to circumvent, but don’t require anyone to submit their ID data. You can still fine the parents if it becomes known, though obviously that’s less likely than if every single user had to submit their ID.
Spaniard here. It was long ago, but never ever had issues on supermarkets. On clubs it was a hit or miss, but just knowing someone who knew someone who knew the bouncer and was good to go. If they still refused, just go to the next one.
There was no night ever were I wanted to get wasted and I couldn’t.
The problem with social media id is not those who circumvent it, is that the rest need to link our ID with our profiles, even if we are old.
I grew up in Germany, where I live supermarkets (and most other places) generally don’t let underage people drink. Supermarket cashiers only fully stopped carding me when I grew a full beard in my late twenties. Might be different in some rural places or different corners of the country, though.
IMO “just need to know someone” can be a pretty big barrier if you don’t know many people (and specifically people who would let underage people drink) or just aren’t that popular.
Sure different counties had different situations. I’m the UK I had to show my id while being 24 very commonly, the year before I lived on NL and was never asked.
A year after UK, it was asked without fail in the US even for a beer during lunch.
My favorite was in Ireland, while being 16, couldn’t get anybody to get me drinks from a store. I just thought “fuck it” and went to a Spar to buy vodka, handing my id immediately to the cashier.
He looked at it and turned out multiple times. It was in Spanish and he wasn’t familiar with it. Either he didn’t care, or war ashamed to ask, but just handed back and let me buy.
[citation needed]
It’s certainly possible to circumvent it, but where I live most people don’t become regular drinkers at 15. It makes it harder to access, and many people actually do want to follow the law. IMO a social media ban is going to work the same way - many will circumvent it, but many others won’t bother.
Never seen the group of underage boys waiting outside the shop for the 18 old friend to buy beer (or any other liqueur) for everyone ?
Neither where I live boys became drinkers at 15 (oh well, some do) but the point is that if a “filter” or ban where you need to be present and there is a person to check is easily circumvented, the classic example of the older friend who buy beers for everyone, I have no faith that a ban based on something virtual has any chance of success. True, it would be harder than the old “are you old enough to access the site” version, but you understimate 15 year old boys (and girls obviously). There are ways to make the ban work but I have the feeling that these solutions would be considered intrusive and against privacy.
For example, the social network can ask for the SSN (or equivalent) and check against the entity responsible to assign the number to check if is valid and of legal age and then keep the number to avoid to be used by someone else (like they keep the email).
But a solution like this is too easy to abuse: the social network has a SSN that they know it is true and valid and the state know a certain person has an account on a certain social network, now imagine the state that ask also the nickname you used on the social network to validate your SSN…
I never said that it’s impossible to circumvent. It’s just harder than if there were no restriction at all, and that does make a difference. And buying alcohol for your 1-year-younger friend is one thing, but buying alcohol for a 15yo is quite another. When I was that age, few people regularly hung out with people that much younger.
I agree that this type of social media ban shouldn’t be made at all, though. What I do want is filters that can be activated by parents that are relatively difficult to circumvent, but don’t require anyone to submit their ID data. You can still fine the parents if it becomes known, though obviously that’s less likely than if every single user had to submit their ID.
Spaniard here. It was long ago, but never ever had issues on supermarkets. On clubs it was a hit or miss, but just knowing someone who knew someone who knew the bouncer and was good to go. If they still refused, just go to the next one.
There was no night ever were I wanted to get wasted and I couldn’t.
The problem with social media id is not those who circumvent it, is that the rest need to link our ID with our profiles, even if we are old.
I grew up in Germany, where I live supermarkets (and most other places) generally don’t let underage people drink. Supermarket cashiers only fully stopped carding me when I grew a full beard in my late twenties. Might be different in some rural places or different corners of the country, though.
IMO “just need to know someone” can be a pretty big barrier if you don’t know many people (and specifically people who would let underage people drink) or just aren’t that popular.
Sure different counties had different situations. I’m the UK I had to show my id while being 24 very commonly, the year before I lived on NL and was never asked. A year after UK, it was asked without fail in the US even for a beer during lunch.
My favorite was in Ireland, while being 16, couldn’t get anybody to get me drinks from a store. I just thought “fuck it” and went to a Spar to buy vodka, handing my id immediately to the cashier. He looked at it and turned out multiple times. It was in Spanish and he wasn’t familiar with it. Either he didn’t care, or war ashamed to ask, but just handed back and let me buy.